Hard long start cold no start hot runs rough

ascrap2003

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Ok got my self a handfull

Working on a truck

Truck history based on what I can tell

Poor oil change history/poor maintenance

Had a long start cold with loud injectors and a miss
after 3-5 minutes injectors got quite still a miss & low power
But would run start & drive.

ICP, IPR, FICM readings etc were all good at the time.

I performed the following.

Replace injector o rings including top oring & cleaned spool valves 600 grit re assembled. 2 of the injectors had a problem pulling the spool valve out so I sanded this a lot more till they would some what go in easy & slide side to side easily.

Rail nipples felt firm & snug when moving so rail orings good I think.

Replaced 1 damamged stand pipe

New valve cover gaskets, new gp harnesses.

First start long obviously when started ran crappy then smoothed out & a lot quiter. Ran good & smooth till warm up but never gave any pedal effort or anything.

After warm up ran rough miss low power then died and no start after that, checked ipr high & icp low suspected hpo leak

Replaced other stand pipe & 2 dummy plugs also replaced fuel filter, fresh oil & filter all motor craft placed a quart of mystery oil & tranny fluid to clean system & injectors

Starts cold run ok maybe a lil rough but once warm runs rough and miss. After hot hard start/No start most times

Start IPR 50%-80% when hot
Icp anywhere from 500-1400

Checked base oil pressure gauge good but filter housing takes over 10 seconds to fill when cold but it does fill, drain back valve is intact.

Fuel bowl also fills but havent checked actual pressure on fuel or lpo

Hot idle
ICP 1400-1500
IPR 45%
FICM Good
STARTER 160 RPM +
BATT GOOD


Codes:

INJECTORS
P0266
P0281
P0284

COOLING/FAN
P0480
P0528

CMP/CKP
P0614
P0617

GP SYSTEM
P0670
P0674
P0683

Cluster Code Oil Press Switch
C1284
Oil Press on dash keeps going back and forth.

My toughts:

I perfomed bubble test and seen small bubbles in fuel bowl
Injector/s?

Check Compression on each cylinder and remove plugs while re performing bubble test replace any injector that is suspected thru bubble test including injectors 2,7 & 8

Not really suspecting compression but you never know engine cranks over evenly

Needs
All New Injectors Maybe?
Injectors bad to begin with maybe worse & leaking oil psi since I replaced o rings & messed with spool valves

Check Fuel Press & Replace Pump If Low

Maybe new STC fitting and or IPR clogged

How do I check base oil pressure to get actual psi?

Any techs out there what are your toughts?
 

SmokeyStroker

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Your icp at idle is way high. 6.0 needs about 450 to 500 to start and most I see run anywhere from 550 to 650 at idle. My bet would be a bad ipr. Pull the ipr and check the screen. Ids/scan tools can show ipr to be good, and they aren't. I had a 4.5L powerstroke in today that was doing the same exact thing. Icp was in the 1100 to 1200 range and it would not start unless I play with the throttle to match the tp with icp. Put an ipr and a #1 injector in it and fixed all the issues. Hope this helps.:thumbsup:
Also 45% from an ipr at idle is way high. 20 to 21 is goal at idle.

Btw 4.5 powerstroke is a 6.0 with 2 missing cylinders, uses the same ipr and injector as a 6.0. Turbo setup looks like a 6.4 though.
 
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ICP at 1400-1500 usually indicates a bad ICP sensor or pigtail. I would recommend a new set of injectors, do all High pressure oil system updates and see what it does.
 

ascrap2003

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I'm leaning on at least 3-4 injectors since I get a code for 3 and truck failed bubble test I'm also leaning on ipr and or stc.


You got me thinking on that icp I've been wanting to get a multimeter on it and also check top port plugs on both rails

Started it up today started in under 3 seconds yay and when cold ran perfect gonna wait till tommorow and start here up again connected to AE to see icp and ipr when cold maybe that will rule them out and it's either injector or stc related


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I'm leaning on at least 3-4 injectors since I get a code for 3 and truck failed bubble test I'm also leaning on ipr and or stc.


You got me thinking on that icp I've been wanting to get a multimeter on it and also check top port plugs on both rails

Started it up today started in under 3 seconds yay and when cold ran perfect gonna wait till tommorow and start here up again connected to AE to see icp and ipr when cold maybe that will rule them out and it's either injector or stc related


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Check ICP voltage with a scan tool. If it's showing 0 volts then it's in default mode. Could be as simple as a bent pin in the sensor.
 

ascrap2003

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If that's the case if I unplug it when hot will that fix the issue temporary till I replace icp?


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ascrap2003

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Something else I was thinking the atf and mystery oil might have changed viscosity enough to cause a no start hot so I changed oil filled with fresh 15-40 still no start of the engine is somewhat warm but it has fresh cool oil wouldn't that let it start and run as if cold if it was a hpo leak?


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ascrap2003

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Would an ipr problem always be present hot or cold? Thinking more n more about injectors gonna put set of warrens in seeing good things about them


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ascrap2003

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Ipr could mess with the truck whether it's hot or cold. Did you check the icp connector like Luke said?



Icp connector looks decent a lil dirty but not soaked, voltage at koeo was 0.25 & 14.8% duty cycle. A little over a volt on cold idle pressure make its all the way down to about 700psi and duty about 25% right around than 120 oil temp problem starts and psi goes to 1100-1400 and 35%-45% duty and starts missing/no power/throttle response
When cold starting 40% - 60% duty and jumps to over 1000psi then settles down from there till problem starts. I'm trying to find out thru ford if truck already came with updated stc fitting "threaded" and will do sticks and check ipr or replace ipr. Before I messed with it truck was running a lil rough missing but not dying hard start some times but by 3rd try hot would start and was drive able.


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ascrap2003

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The oil gauge keeps going on and off hope something didn't get caught in front cover area.


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ascrap2003

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There's no way it could be electrical can it? PCM yadda yadda FICM looks good all the time thinking of checking FICM sync when problem starts also


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ascrap2003

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Ok started taken it back apart sending injectors off tommorow to warren

got a OTC ipr took but couldn't break it loose feels like 75 ft lbs or more felt like I was gonna break something "My knuckles" so I let it be and will spray some blaster on it

Checked fuel pressure koeo or idle 60psi few Revs 60psi plus

And
Base oil pressure takes at least 10 seconds to fill reservoir after a about 3 seconds cranking about 4-5 psi

about 7 seconds cranking starts climbing fast to 20-30 psi
Smokey sorry haven't got with you been busy


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SmokeyStroker

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Its fine. Easiest way to check base engine oil pressure is to remove the oil filter cap and filter, use a long screw driver to press the BLACK not BRONZE spring loaded plug down and have someone turn over the engine while you hold that plug down. The oil filter housing should be a minimum half full 3 to 4 seconds into cranking the engine.
 

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