slight issue with southbend clutch. PO installed

[m j]

need a new disc for it.
anyone know a part number for a replacement disc?
looks like it was a 1944-5OFEK

 

[Magnum PD]

Wouldn't be under warranty would it?

 

[Patrick Feeley]

I had a throwout bearing grenade and mess mine up years ago on the 94. I just called up SBC and ordered a new one from them. Cheers!

 

[7.3psd97444]

You arent the only one! Why I love my Valair and will go with Valair from no on. My truck was BONE stock, and never driven hard, nor did it ever tow with this clutch.

 

[7.3psd97444]

And since yours, m j, lost a spring too, ide bet your flywheel looks like mine in the second picture...

 

[m j]

thank you for the responses.
is the valair clutch bolt pattern the same as the SBC? can I use my existing flywheel?
my friends dual disc SBC died (broken lever and I cant recall if it was the pivot gone on one of the others or a spring) a week before I pulled my single disc too. he went with another SBC as that is what is here locally.

 

[m j]

it looks like valairs are basically a sachs clutch, which might be a zf company

K70263-01CB is sachs ceramic number
K70263-01KL is sachs Kevlar number

http://cctransmissionparts.com/images/SACHS_CATALOG.pdf

I ordered a ceramic from ebay.
I think my flywheel is salvagable

 

[7.3psd97444]

Im not sure about using other companies disks with other flywheel/pressure plates. But I just ditched my entire SBC setup and got all new stuff from Dan at Valair. He was awesome to deal with. I got thier 600hp/100 ft-lb rated ceramic single disk. Its flawless and very heavy duty. No weak ass spring holder setup like on the SBC pictured above.

 

[96F350KID]

We ONLY use Valair and those are the reasons why Let me know if I can get you one coming. Keep them in stock. The single cab has a ceramic dual disc, My dually has a ceramic, the pull truck has a dual disc SI, and Jesse's truck has a ceramic one in it.....ya we really like Valair stuff here

P.S notice the sigVVVVVVV

 

[7.3psd97444]

We ONLY use Valair and those are the reasons why Let me know if I can get you one coming. Keep them in stock. The single cab has a ceramic dual disc, My dually has a ceramic, the pull truck has a dual disc SI, and Jesse's truck has a ceramic one in it.....ya we really like Valair stuff here

P.S notice the sigVVVVVVV

If I ever get to the point where im blowing past this cermic single, ill be looking into a dual disk. Mainly DD'ing and towing. But also some pulling and racing. I know Valair has a gnarly dd puller clutch, but how about a dd you can daily and pull?

 

[96F350KID]

If I ever get to the point where im blowing past this cermic single, ill be looking into a dual disk. Mainly DD'ing and towing. But also some pulling and racing. I know Valair has a gnarly dd puller clutch, but how about a dd you can daily and pull?

You can DD with a sintered iron dual disc but the shifting will be slow and you won't want to drive it much. I can drive the pull truck on the road with no issues but starting and stopping suck. The single cab can drive with no issues and thats a cermaic dual disc. I set guys up with organic dual discs to tow with all the time and they love em! Ceramic sucks to back up but if you're 4x4 just put it in 4 low.

 

[Garbage_Mechanic]

That is exacly what my SBC looked like!

You arent the only one! Why I love my Valair and will go with Valair from no on. My truck was BONE stock, and never driven hard, nor did it ever tow with this clutch.

I recently pulled out my SBC that had 100,000 miles mostly just driving, a little towing. It wouldn't release, the springs were out and balled up just exacly the same as the pics above. It had always vibrated too, which I beleive contributed to the kevlar pilot bushing wallowing out. To give you an idea how rough a life it had, I compared thickness to a new disc and there was ZERO measureable cluch material worn off. 99% driven by my wife who is no lily but not abusive either.

Here is what I learned:

SBC admits they had a bad run of flywheels. Mine was about 8 years old. Back when I got it SBC referred me to a Ford TSB using extra washers on the clutch cover bolts to balance. I should have never bought that as a fix but didn't have time to pull the trans again. With the new flywheel the engine is sooo much smoother!
The flywheel wasn't out of balance but had runout. This caused wear to the pilot bushing the clutch diaphagm where the thowout bearing rests and the throwout it self. I think it is actually the cause of the "thrown" springs as well. So probably this is less likely since SBC checks runout and balance on all flywheels now.

There are two disc designs for the organic set up. The one SBC supplies and the one Valair supplies. SBC says they can supply the one Valair supplies but don't because it is noisier (I agree it is a little) It is also more rugged and has more springs. They each have a name like LUK and Eaton or Spicer but I can't recall exactly.

So I am happy with the Valair, it is noisier, and a little bit of chatter. The disc springs appear to be more rugged. The flywheel is true and balanced. I'll let you know in 8 years if it is better!

I beleive SBC has fixed the issue with the flywheels that caused my issue. I think they could have handled it better back then, and so have I. I discussed this at lenght with them and I beleive they have this handled.

IIRC the Valair was quite bit cheeper, and even though SBC admitted what the issues were in the past and guaranteed them the be solved. I went with Valair to give the "new guy" a test. We'll see!

 

[7.3psd97444]

I recently pulled out my SBC that had 100,000 miles mostly just driving, a little towing. It wouldn't release, the springs were out and balled up just exacly the same as the pics above. It had always vibrated too, which I beleive contributed to the kevlar pilot bushing wallowing out. To give you an idea how rough a life it had, I compared thickness to a new disc and there was ZERO measureable cluch material worn off. 99% driven by my wife who is no lily but not abusive either.

Here is what I learned:

SBC admits they had a bad run of flywheels. Mine was about 8 years old. Back when I got it SBC referred me to a Ford TSB using extra washers on the clutch cover bolts to balance. I should have never bought that as a fix but didn't have time to pull the trans again. With the new flywheel the engine is sooo much smoother!
The flywheel wasn't out of balance but had runout. This caused wear to the pilot bushing the clutch diaphagm where the thowout bearing rests and the throwout it self. I think it is actually the cause of the "thrown" springs as well. So probably this is less likely since SBC checks runout and balance on all flywheels now.

There are two disc designs for the organic set up. The one SBC supplies and the one Valair supplies. SBC says they can supply the one Valair supplies but don't because it is noisier (I agree it is a little) It is also more rugged and has more springs. They each have a name like LUK and Eaton or Spicer but I can't recall exactly.

So I am happy with the Valair, it is noisier, and a little bit of chatter. The disc springs appear to be more rugged. The flywheel is true and balanced. I'll let you know in 8 years if it is better!

I beleive SBC has fixed the issue with the flywheels that caused my issue. I think they could have handled it better back then, and so have I. I discussed this at lenght with them and I beleive they have this handled.

IIRC the Valair was quite bit cheeper, and even though SBC admitted what the issues were in the past and guaranteed them the be solved. I went with Valair to give the "new guy" a test. We'll see!

Very good information. And what you say causes the springs to "throw out" makes sense. But I also think it has something to do with how the springs are held in. Even in brand new form, when you look at it, it does not look very tolerable or strong at all. Compare this to an equal Valair organic disk of the same time, and theres a big difference. I understand the heavier duty disks from SBC like the ceramics and dd's are built differently and dont use the same spring setup, but for stock trucks they shouldnt have ever done what the pictures show above.

 

[96F350KID]

Just as an FYI what you guys and many people that have come into the shop with a LUK clutch see the same thing. The springs are to soft and "bind" up so much that they open the channel up they are sitting it which causes the spring to fall out in my opinion. Thats what i can figure, makes a little sense right? lol

 

[Binder man]

Let me look up the SBC stuff and I'll shoot you a quote over.

 

[Garbage_Mechanic]

Lets face it guys these custom clutches aren't magic and are mostly based on the experience of what works and what doesn't. There are some new custom parts fabricated, but mostly modifications to off the shelf parts. Not so much when we go to dual disc and so on but these closer to stock ones.
If I remember correctly Valair uses a Rockwell, Meritor, Eaton or other recognizeable brand of disc. It appears more durable but makes more noise.
In this series of clutch, the plate load (clamping force) and friction materials change but how many manufacturers of covers and discs are there?

I wish I could find my notes on it from when I replaced my SBC with Valair. I have no idea where we will be down the road with the Valair, in all fairness I think a lot of the problems with the SBC were the out of round flywheel.