Best Studs/Head Gaskets?

Triumph1188

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I have seen lots of people running ARPs and stock HGs. I haven't heard of anything better than stock gaskets, but it seems like there are enough people still blowing them at higher power levels (600ish). Would a higher tensile strength stud help? Or would it be a better HG? Or is it something that is simply unavoidable when you add power, because the design of the heads only has 10 studs per bank? I know the clamping force isn't as uniform due to the design of the engine. I haven't seen any great reviews about oring or fire ringed heads.

I'm curious what the most reliable setup has been tested to be. If I have to spend over a grand to get higher tensile strength studs but it will be much more reliable I will.

Thanks for any feedback!
 

Mdub707

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The most reliable setup is when everything is thought out and well planned, and the proper sequence of events is used. There are many factors that go into a stud job on a 6.0. The heads being flat is the biggest and most often overlooked it seems. ARP studs are just fine. What good is a higher tensile strength stud going to do? The ARP is already stronger than the block material. The only benefit I saw from using H11's with a higher tensile strength is the final torque number is lower, so for guys doing them with the cab on that could be advantageous. A1 technologies (who manufactures the H11's) closed shop last I knew anyway.

The OEM gaskets are fine. In fact, most aftermarket companies are now having their headgaskets made on the same line as the OEM gaskets. The new Victor Reinz gaskets are the same gasket except they have a black seal on the gasket and OEM has blue. Made on the same line.

The studs are not the problem, the gaskets are not the problem. The problem is typically the job not being done correctly. With that said, at the end of the day, you will still see gaskets give out here and there, it's going to happen when you cram a ton of air and fuel in there.

The most reliable is likely just doing ARP's and OEM gaskets (or VR, or RCD's gaskets... they're all the same) and following proper procedure. Use the ARP lube, have flat heads, flat block...
 

KCTurbos

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We have been seeing more and more that standard arp studs and stock oem gaskets are failing... even after all the proper prep work, making sure block and heads are flat, etc...


I have my theories but it all boils down the the multi layered MLS gasket, the sealant compound around the fire ring, and the low tensile strength of the arp studs. Ask yourself why the 6.4 guys have less problems??? they have the same crappy 4 bolt per cylinder design, they use the same MLS gasket, but they seem to have much fewer problems. I think it comes down to better tensile strength of the thicker bolt they use that saves them, but they still fail.



I know everyone is going to jump on and say... but lots of guys have made big power on standard arp studs and OEM gaskets. Well I would venture to say that many of those guys eventually blew their gaskets or maybe don't drive them long enough to see a small leak. I would also venture to say that for every 5 guys who made descent power on standard arps and OEM gaskets... well 50 had repeat failures.

My truck recently started leaking. It only puked if I spent over an hour on the dyno testing. I attributed it to getting to hot and overfilling the degas. Well I eventually stuck a gauge on the truck and tested the psi of the degas bottle. Everything check out ok for normal driving, but if I got on it super hard the psi would go up about 2-3psi every run. Well after about 10 super hard runs my truck puked. My heads were not blown, just leaking. It would be hard to see a slight leak going down the track. You would probably only see it while going up a really long hill or if you spent all day on the dyno.

Another thing to think about is with a big vgt turbo and/or compound setup you are going to see super high cylinder pressures because of the large amounts of boost that you see at such low rpms along with the added back pressure/drive pressure. I believe that also adds to the people making big power and blowing gaskets. I would also venture to say that guys with large single non vgt turbos have less problems because they make their boost later in the rpm band when the flow rate of the motor can handle it better. 45psi at 2500rpms is way different than 45psi at 4000 rpms.

Some say over torquing the stand arp's help (like 230-250)
h-11s seemed to be a better option until they went out of business
ARP 625s are very expensive.
I like the new extreme stud option but I have seen very few reviews (i have set going in soon)
I also like the oring idea (not fire ring). I am going to be testing out that route also.




Stock??? 190,000 psi
normal ARP = 220,000 $450
extreme studs 240,000 $575
A1 H11 = 240,000 $750 (out of business)
aged ARP = 250,000 $1300
 

KCTurbos

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^^^^^

EDIT: "I think it comes down to better tensile strength of the thicker bolt they use that saves them, but they still fail."


I meant better clamping force... not tensile strength. The metal is the same and has the same tensile strength but the thicker stud/bolt creates a better clamping force and is much stronger.
 

KCTurbos

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I'm bumping this back up...


I was actually hoping more guys would jump in and rebuttal the info I posted or share their own experiences.
 

04stroker

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We have had no issues whatsoever on 6.4/6.0 engines using OEM gaskets and ARP studs. As long as surfaces are prepped properly and a good torque sequence is used you should have no problems. I sound like a broken record seems like there is a thread like this everyday and I say the same thing every time. I will not get into torque specs or sequence we use as a lot of people do not agree with me but to date the only one I have ever had an issue with was using aftermarket head gaskets. Switched back to OEM ok that truck no problems since.
 

KCTurbos

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We have had no issues whatsoever on 6.4/6.0 engines using OEM gaskets and ARP studs. As long as surfaces are prepped properly and a good torque sequence is used you should have no problems. I sound like a broken record seems like there is a thread like this everyday and I say the same thing every time. I will not get into torque specs or sequence we use as a lot of people do not agree with me but to date the only one I have ever had an issue with was using aftermarket head gaskets. Switched back to OEM ok that truck no problems since.

What kinda power levels and driving styles?


I also know a lot of people that swear by the OEM gaskets and ARP method but I have also been seeing more and more guys that keep trying this method and failing. They are all doing everything exactly right and after about 6-12 months they start leaking again. Some even bought new long blocks and had all the machine work done right
 

loboost

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What kinda power levels and driving styles?

This, IMO makes or breaks it.

I have had 1 std ARP/OEM combo come back...and that was on a compounded truck.

I'm my experience ARP/OEM is the most cost effective route for I/T/E trucks.

But I haven't used or seen any of the extreme studs yet. For the $ difference, they may be a better option.

sent while driving recklessly
 

04stroker

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Anywhere from stock to 600+ horsepower daily driven trucks. Not too many people I do work for are easy on them either they like using the power and having fun with them. Obviously bigger power the more likely to have issues overtime. I have nothing and to say about any of the studs on the market. I used H-11's on my old 6.0 my Trap speed put my truck at around 575rwhp and it was beat on and towed with daily. Never had any issues with it either. Id like to try the extreme studs they seem pretty cost effective but don't really have a reason to try them as of now.
 

Josh@DirtyDiesels

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I run stock gaskets and standard ARP's (which have been reused 3 times now...) My heads are also O-ringed. Studs torqued to 225ft/lbs. Last time the heads were off a 366 and 225's went in, and now it currently has 305/150's and a 475 on it. No issues here, knock on wood. It has been a year and roughly 15k miles. Oh and I like to drive my truck hard. Setup has also seen a little spray here and there. 700rwhp setup driven lots and not a single issue.
 

KCTurbos

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I run stock gaskets and standard ARP's (which have been reused 3 times now...) My heads are also O-ringed. Studs torqued to 225ft/lbs. Last time the heads were off a 366 and 225's went in, and now it currently has 305/150's and a 475 on it. No issues here, knock on wood. It has been a year and roughly 15k miles. Oh and I like to drive my truck hard. Setup has also seen a little spray here and there. 700rwhp setup driven lots and not a single issue.

So... u r running orings? With OEM gaskets?



I don't think that counts as just arp and oem gaskets LOL
 

Josh@DirtyDiesels

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Yes O-rings and oem gaskets. I mean I have oem gaskets and arp's so it must count... But honestly if you have a good machine shop to do the o rings I don't see why you wouldn't. It really isn't that expensive.
 

KCTurbos

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So does the oring just crush the oem gaskets? Or did you have to cut the gaskts? I have never seen that option
 

mcdaniel1991

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Just called extreme studs, Im waiting to hear back. Im about to pull my cab and I'm trying to get as much info on these as possible. Is anyone out there using these in a 6.0 for any high power and how many miles?
 

Josh@DirtyDiesels

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****ty pic but...
zurajepy.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Josh@DirtyDiesels

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Just called extreme studs, Im waiting to hear back. Im about to pull my cab and I'm trying to get as much info on these as possible. Is anyone out there using these in a 6.0 for any high power and how many miles?

don't know of anyone using them. I might try them next time my heads come off.
 

KCTurbos

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Thanks for the pic... so you just install that over the OEM gaskets? That must just crush.


Those look like UFC heads? Do you know what kind they are?




I really like the Oring option. It seems to add a little extra give for when the studs stretch under high cylinder pressures
 

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