Multiple Radiator Failure - Cause

[MorganY]

I am reaching out to anyone with significant information/experience on rad failures.

I have one 2008 that will be on it's 7th (yes, 7th) radiator in a 40k mile span. The truck is driven on and off road around a ranch, pulls fairly heavy, and would be what I consider to be under heavy use.

It has been been through 4 Ford radiators, and 2 aftermarket aluminum units. On the most recent aluminum radiator, I replaced the front cab isolators, upper and lower portions, and it has just now killed radiator number 6.

At this point I am under the assumption the problem is occurring from the core support/body flex, but there has to be a problem somewhere for this to be happening to an extent like this.

Is it absurd to begin looking at things like welds, and pinch points along the core support/body? There must be a problem I have missed, because I have customers with 150k on their original job 1 truck...


Thanks

 

[SEABEE08FX4]

Its due to flex in the chassis without a doubt. I don't know what it will take to prevent it short of re-engineering some sort of brace for the front end to keep the radiator from absorbing the flex. I've done two trucks with poly mounts but not enough time / miles on them to see if that will help at all yet.

 

[AirFishAutomotive]

what about cross bracing it between the frame?

 

[MorganY]

The only solution I can think of is a tubular core support, such as the one on a 6.0. That structure is less susceptible to twisting, unlike the version on the 6.4. When the support twists, it goes straight into the end tanks.

What I don't understand is that I have seen trucks that never unhook from their horse trailer, and still don't have any failures..I don't believe its the luck of the draw.

 

[Powerstroke Man 6.4]

I too would like to find out whats causing this problem I put a mishimoto aluminum unit in my larait a couple months ago because of cracked end tanks on a OEM unit. Its a job 3 267,000 miles. IDK if that was the original radiator or not but I hope I don't need to buy another one.

 

[footlong70]

Definitely a flex issue. I haven't had a chance to look at the rads/rad support apart, but I would think the easier solution than trying to re-engineer the rad support stronger and flex less, would be to make the rad "float" more in its brackets. Or make the brackets "float" more. Then let the rad support flex all it wants while the radiator never holds the stress of the truck on it. I'm sure something could be fabbed or figured out.

 

[LovinPSDs]

What I don't understand is that I have seen trucks that never unhook from their horse trailer, and still don't have any failures..I don't believe its the luck of the draw.

I think this is quite a bit different than being driven around the ranch/heavy use often. To me the flex doesn't mean dragging a horse trailer up and down the interstate, but when the truck gets bound up in offroad situations. Not saying a have the answer, but I wouldn't try to compare a ranch truck to a hot shot or horse hualer truck.

Would be interesting to see what Eric has fabbed up.

 

[AllGo'N'Show]

Do you know where each of your rads have failed? If they are failing in the same location then it could most definitely be a problem replicating itself. If welds are leaking in different places every time or cores are failing/leaking then you may have quality/pressure/hg/degas/etc.. issues.

With that said... I'm on the same page as the flex issues and am trying modified upper mounts this time

 

[powerstrokedkid87]

Morgan-

I know I have been in talks with Mishimoto regarding issues they have been having with body flex and radiators cracking ect. I know they are working on an updated radiator again to help fix the issue. We are currently on unit number 5 in a customers truck as well.

From my understanding this new unit will have rubber mounts on them to help absorb some of the flex and vibration they are seeing with these things.

 

[blk350on20s]

I don't think flex/mounting is an issue. My truck gets absolutely destroyed off road and the only issue I had was a radiator at 17k miles. Did the venturi and radiator at the same time. My stock replacement was still good when I put my Alradco in. The truck has around 105k on it now.

 

[B585Ford]

I don't think flex/mounting is an issue. My truck gets absolutely destroyed off road and the only issue I had was a radiator at 17k miles. Did the venturi and radiator at the same time. My stock replacement was still good when I put my Alradco in. The truck has around 105k on it now.

Yeah with the sand dunes I would think your truck would see all kinds of flex

 

[blk350on20s]

And that is probably the least of its beat downs. Mountain hill climbs and ORV trails at high speeds kill it LOL

 

[powerstroked08]

And that is probably the least of its beat downs. Mountain hill climbs and ORV trails at high speeds kill it LOL

Not to mention all of the hogs you put in the poor truck! Now that's a loadLOL

 

[Mishimoto]

I am reaching out to anyone with significant information/experience on rad failures.

I have one 2008 that will be on it's 7th (yes, 7th) radiator in a 40k mile span. The truck is driven on and off road around a ranch, pulls fairly heavy, and would be what I consider to be under heavy use.

It has been been through 4 Ford radiators, and 2 aftermarket aluminum units. On the most recent aluminum radiator, I replaced the front cab isolators, upper and lower portions, and it has just now killed radiator number 6.

At this point I am under the assumption the problem is occurring from the core support/body flex, but there has to be a problem somewhere for this to be happening to an extent like this.

Is it absurd to begin looking at things like welds, and pinch points along the core support/body? There must be a problem I have missed, because I have customers with 150k on their original job 1 truck...

Thanks

Sorry to hear about the issues you are having with radiator failure. It seems as though some folks are experiencing repetitive failures even after converting to an aluminum radiator. Have you completed all TSB's recommended for your truck? Have you checked your cab isolator bushings at all? Our team put together a radiator pre-installation checklist to help folks improve the longevity of their radiator. Check it out at the link below, be sure that all of these items are inspected and replaced as needed.

http://engineering.mishimoto.com/?cat=105

I am not sure which radiator in particular you are currently using. However if it is a Mishimoto unit, we would be very interested in speaking with you about your truck, failure rate, and a few design modifications we have been working on.

Shoot us a PM if you have a moment!

Thanks

Its due to flex in the chassis without a doubt. I don't know what it will take to prevent it short of re-engineering some sort of brace for the front end to keep the radiator from absorbing the flex. I've done two trucks with poly mounts but not enough time / miles on them to see if that will help at all yet.

Definitely a flex issue. I haven't had a chance to look at the rads/rad support apart, but I would think the easier solution than trying to re-engineer the rad support stronger and flex less, would be to make the rad "float" more in its brackets. Or make the brackets "float" more. Then let the rad support flex all it wants while the radiator never holds the stress of the truck on it. I'm sure something could be fabbed or figured out.

Morgan-

I know I have been in talks with Mishimoto regarding issues they have been having with body flex and radiators cracking ect. I know they are working on an updated radiator again to help fix the issue. We are currently on unit number 5 in a customers truck as well.

From my understanding this new unit will have rubber mounts on them to help absorb some of the flex and vibration they are seeing with these things.

Thanks guys! Yes, we are working on several experimental designs which modify the upper mounting points for greater isolation between the radiator and core support. We have been able to link several failures to trucks with damaged/worn isolator bushings as well.

As mentioned in other threads, we have thousands of customers running our radiator with great success. We also have a small portion of customers who are still experiencing failures after switching over to our aluminum radiator. Our goal is to evaluate these particular vehicles and modify our product design to combat this potential failure point. At this time, we have several trucks on the road with one of our prototypes, so far we have not experienced additional failures. We are still waiting for the test vehicles to accumulate additional mileage before we bring them back in for evaluation.

We would be happy to answer any additional questions regarding our radiator!

Thanks