My Redemption build

Jomax

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Went up North again towing a lighter gooseneck trailer... probably around 6-7k. We were cutting down and hauling out trees.



Truck did great. You could hardly tell it was back there going up the big hills as long as you had the tow/haul button on (which locks out OD on my custom tune). I was normally around 900-1100 egts going up the hills. Ran about 100-200 degrees cooler than before when we had the 12k trailer behind it.



I could tow fine in OD on flat ground but as before it did not like going up an sort of grade under 2000rpms in OD. Just for fun I let it lug down to around 1600rpms while going up a hill locked in OD and it builds boost pretty well... I can build about 15-20psi at 1800rpms before it starts to surge. The problem is that it would start to creep above 1200-1300 egts if I did that. Granted that was up around 7000ft in elevation elevation when I was testing that, lower elevation would be much easier on the truck.





Here is a pic of our 600hp work truck in its natrual habitat :thumbsup:



D40DC917-1417-4F53-89C4-8BD283B5DF71_zps6hl0jmfw.png


Do you do volunteer work for the USFS?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

KCTurbos

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Sorry... this is kind of long, but worth all the info.


It has been a rough couple of weeks, business has been crazy busy and my mom passed away suddenly so I had to take off a lot of personal time... it took me a long time to get caught up on orders and start doing any testing. I am finally getting back into the swing of things, we are finally caught up with orders so I am back to doing what I love... expect lots of testing/results over the next few months.

We had a customer recently ask for a full refund because he was not happy with his brand new stage 2. He said it ran hot and under performed (even when idling). I tried helping him figure out what was wrong but he insisted it was the turbo and ended up sending the turbo back and asked for a full refund. On top of that we were out of stage 3 comp wheels for a while and a customer really needed one so I pulled the stage 3 off my truck and sent it to him. That gave me the perfect opportunity to try out this "defective" stage 2 turbo. Turbo performed flawlessly on my truck.

The stage 2 turbo is so fun to drive around town. It just hits harder and spools faster down low in comparison to the stage 3. The only downside is you can feel the power start to fall off up top where the stage 3 just keeps pulling.


We have been working with a few tuners to produce better tuning for our turbos. We have been working on theories/experiments for over a year and one of them finally worked. I have to give a HUGE SHOUTOUT to Cory and Chris @ Diesels and More. One night while talking turbos at their shop theorizing about how to fix the 6.0 tuning they came up with a KEY component to help solve the tuning problem. I cannot go into super great detail on the specifics... but basically we are able to squeeze more consistent top end power/boost out of these turbos. We are basically working around some of the "flaws" in the 6.0 SCT tuning so our turbos can reach their full potential.

We are able to squeeze about 10psi more out of the turbos on the top end.
The stage 2 turbo consistently hits 40-45psi of boost and HOLDS (before it could hit 40psi, but sometimes the vanes would open and boost would drop down to about 30-35psi after a few seconds)
The stage 3 turbo consistently hits 45-50psi of boost and HOLDS (before it could hit 40-45psi, but sometimes the vanes would open and boost would drop down to about 30-35 after a few seconds, some other tunes we tested could hit 55-60psi of boost but had NO POWER and crazy EBP numbers)

Here are the dyno results:

We tested the truck loaded and un-loaded on the dyno. Up until now I have always tested the trucks "un-loaded" which produces lower results because it does not load up the turbo enough to reach full boost like you can when actually driving the truck. Now that we have our own dyno with and eddy, we can load up the trucks better.

KC 64mm stage 2 turbo with 205/30s

Loaded dyno results
653 hp
1206 tq


By next week we should have numbers for the stage 3 turbo, but I think we are going to have to bump up the injectors to reach the full potential of the turbo.


Here is a screenshot of the stage 2 dyno graph. This is loaded vs unloaded. It is interesting to see how much more power you can squeeze out of the truck when you actually load up the dyno.

15DBB141-6996-44AC-9427-1B746A44F168_zpsnw3jd3gz.png
 

Halestorm55

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Sorry to hear about your mother, my condolences.
Those are some awesome numbers, nice flat curves. That means when I do a trans I have to go up another stage though.

looking up parts
 

Merc82

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Sorry about your mother, Charlie.

That Is extremely impressive though. My only gripe about my setup was the top end. You got me seriously rethinking things now.
 

KCTurbos

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Thanks for the condolences. It was a rough couple of weeks but I am finally doing a little better.

Well we ran the stage 3 last night. I am only a little shy of my original 700hp goal. Truck is completely out of fuel... looks like a stock truck at WOT after the turbo spools.

688hp
1301tq


We also spent some time playing with the Inj PW and ICP to see were fuel and ICP drops off. It seems that these injectors run out of fuel at around 2.4-2.6ms and quit making power. I was able to hold 4.8v of ICP at 2.6-2.8ms of Pulse Width at only a .83% IPR duty cycle so this t500 HPOP is doing great.

Keep in mind that with a dyno a 3-8hp difference between runs is not abnormal with a variation of less than 1% between runs... so it is hard to know if the power stops at 2.4 or 2.6ms because the last two runs were so close.

2.2-2.4ms - 665hp & 1256tq
2.4-2.6ms - 680hp & 1291tq
2.6-2.8ms - 688hp & 1301tq

Here are the graphs:
DE7CA002-07E1-4392-BF27-1E3231370007_zpsgvo1lbye.png



Here is a video that we were taking just to show the exhaust tube popping off. I was amazed when I watched it and saw how clean it was running once the turbo fully spooled. This was the 2.6-2.8ms run at 4.8v

https://youtu.be/BFEeea26VlE

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/BFEeea26VlE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFEeea26VlE&feature=youtu.be
 

FaSSt9602

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Nice numbers Charlie (and Cory, and Chris)!

What does the compressor map of the stage 2 and 3 show? Is the 40-45psi still within it's functional range?

REALLY want to get my truck down there for some tuning. Just wish Cory and Chris would let me come hang out... LOL
 

6.0 Tech

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Nice numbers Charlie (and Cory, and Chris)!

What does the compressor map of the stage 2 and 3 show? Is the 40-45psi still within it's functional range?

REALLY want to get my truck down there for some tuning. Just wish Cory and Chris would let me come hang out... LOL

Hell just stop by their shop, usually they are just acting like they are working... LOL
 

KCTurbos

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Nice numbers Charlie (and Cory, and Chris)!

What does the compressor map of the stage 2 and 3 show? Is the 40-45psi still within it's functional range?

REALLY want to get my truck down there for some tuning. Just wish Cory and Chris would let me come hang out... LOL

Yes they both stay on the map. That is why it has always confused me when guys struggle to get into the 40psi range
 

KCTurbos

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Well... it was a LONG TOUGH WEEKEND!!!

A couple months ago I had someone contact us to inquire about a turbo. He had been running a non-vgt turbo and was super disappointed. He was sold on how "fast" they spooled and how "streetable" and "towable" they can be, but in the end he was super disappointed. He said as soon as he sold his non-vgt kit that he would buy a new turbo from us... so we worked out a deal and he traded his whole kit and turbo to me for a stage 2 turbo.

Now that I have my setup dialed,the dyno up and working, and the stage 2 and stage 3 turbos tested, I thought it would be a good idea to do some non-vgt testing (I have had a lot of requests/call outs to run one on my truck). I am excited to get some actual data because I usually only see a lot of "talk" and no data.

Lets first talk about the install. T-4 non-vgt swaps SUCK to install on a 6.0. I probably should have pulled the cab and bought a new 2 piece downpipe.

If there is a"better" kit out there that is "supposed" to fit right then I HIGHLY suggest getting it... Even if it is more money or has a slight lead time.

Oil drain was super tough to line up but after about 15 tries I finally got it.
The t4 nuts were really hard to tighten. You can only get to them with a stubby wrench but there is no way to put much torque on it to get them tight in such awkward angles with a 2" long wrench.
It was nearly impossible to get the downpipe on. It took 2 people, a floor jack, a 4' pry bar, and about an hour to get the downpipe to line up. It was about an inch off on the top side no matter what we did so we had to use a 4' pry bar to get it to line up and dent the downpipe with a sludge hammer just to get it close enough to put the clamp on. Same downpipe fit perfect for 10-20 vgt turbo swaps.

FDAF1C06-A900-4053-93AE-DD77E421B56C_zpswsikyn4h.png


DF12999A-08A3-45E4-846E-C13647F5F71B_zpsw1qwttqx.png
 

Halestorm55

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So does that mean it gets better or... what kit was it?
For me personally I don't think I could go that route. Just for the fact if something were to happen to a stage 2 after I got it I would have a turbo sitting on the shelf that I could run for the time being. And I want to try to hide everything from an untrained eye so the truck looks stock.

looking up parts
 

Six_Sloww

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Something isn't right with whatever kit you installed.. I had more problems getting the damn v-vband off my stock turbo than I did with my entire CED t4 install.
 

KCTurbos

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Something isn't right with whatever kit you installed.. I had more problems getting the damn v-vband off my stock turbo than I did with my entire CED t4 install.

I am not posting the name of the kit because I don't want to call out or bash the company... but I can tell you it was not a CED t4

I have talked to a lot of other guys and the problems I had were not uncommon as it seems many of the kits seem to be hit or miss. They fit perfect for some people, but then fit like garbage for the next guy. Especially with the oil drain and downpipe not lining up. I guess some manufactures only recommend a certain "downpipe" and/or putting a brand new 2 piece downpipe on when installing the new turbo.

Breaking the turbo down into pieces helped when getting it installed... but I was under the impression that the complete turbo would just drop right in, so I tried that route first.

Also EVERYONE I have talked to said the t-4 up pipe nuts are a pain to get to. There is just no way around that. Someone suggested that I "double nut" them to help keep them tight, I guess they are prone to backing off.
 

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