p0088 with Spartan runs like crap, Load H&S runs great

08twinturbo · Sep 25, 2013

I have had several buddies trucks cutting back on other tuners that h&s cured as well. They never had any fuel pump problems after swapping over to h&s. Maybe they dont demand as much fuel pressure. They still run great though.

skobiak · Sep 27, 2013

From what I read on the spartan forum they are aware of the problem, but dont want to widen the parameters. The same advice was given to replace the HPFP.

Moremph · Sep 29, 2013

3 weeks now truck runs great, Im thinking more of a Spartan problem, Its kinda like saying my Tires only have 75% tread left on em, they are going bad better change em now, Just dont make sense!

drunk on diesel · Sep 29, 2013

agree!!

AirFishAutomotive · Sep 29, 2013

Sweet just replaced a hpfp because it kept throwing that code with spartan.....

webb06 · Sep 29, 2013

Moremph said:
3 weeks now truck runs great, Im thinking more of a Spartan problem, Its kinda like saying my Tires only have 75% tread left on em, they are going bad better change em now, Just dont make sense!

I'm curious how it would act with stock tuning.

golfer · Sep 30, 2013

webb06 said:
I'm curious how it would act with stock tuning.

..yeah..sounds like the ol' P1211 code with the 7.3L.

everyone still throws HPOP's at those like gangbusters...

drunk on diesel · Sep 30, 2013

My one ton has popped an 0088 a couple times. If I watch the scanner it only happens at light load/cruise coming off a hill and back to level ground. The regulator is sticking. If I keep the fuel doped up with Power Service it doesn't have the issue. No problem making full pressure, it's just at that light load probably because my truck has spent most of its life running down the highway at light load.

I don't have the desire to pull the cab if unnecessary

Jeff@Spartan · Oct 1, 2013

The reason we have not widened the parameters is simply because we feel it is a ticking time bomb. We have a certified Ford diesel technician who works for us and knows the fuel system on these trucks inside and out. He is also well aware of the "band-aid" flash that Josh Clark of Darkhorse Diesel Performance referenced earlier in this thread. Using his professional opinion, we opted out of widening the parameters to suit the new flash. We feel that a pump replacement is a much better route to go than potentially grenading the fuel system down the road because we went along with Ford's band-aid flash.

dieseljosh07 · Oct 1, 2013

SPARTAN said:
The reason we have not widened the parameters is simply because we feel it is a ticking time bomb. We have a certified Ford diesel technician who works for us and knows the fuel system on these trucks inside and out. He is also well aware of the "band-aid" flash that Josh Clark of Darkhorse Diesel Performance referenced earlier in this thread. Using his professional opinion, we opted out of widening the parameters to suit the new flash. We feel that a pump replacement is a much better route to go than potentially grenading the fuel system down the road because we went along with Ford's band-aid flash.

Good post, thanks Jeff.

Moremph · Nov 21, 2013

Two months down now and no sighns of pump failure, However we did have to take the paper weight spartan tuner off the truck because it made the truck 100% un useable, With the other tuners on the market it works great, Spartan wake up change your upper limits instead of dictating that a customer must drop 2k dollars to fix a problem that isnt really a problem yet. Three customers trucks now have come in with spartan tuners that have had this issue so far! and all three when other tuners are installed run perfect.

This is like saying your tires are at 75% gotta buy new ones cuz they are going to wear out.

Travis

webb06 · Nov 21, 2013

Except when a pump fails miserably it costs $6-7k. Not $1400 like tires.

pog · Nov 21, 2013

:stupid:

golfer · Nov 21, 2013

is this code not equivalent to a "ICP low" code on a HEUI engine?

how would that 'code' definitively isolate the pump as the cause for low rail pressure, and not the VCV, PCV, or an injector issue?

any loss of efficiency/leak is going to cause low rail pressure...but wouldn't/couldn't identify the source of the inefficiency.

is this like saying that every HEUI engine that can't maintain ICP needs a pump asap, no?

Moremph · Dec 1, 2013

golfer said:
is this code not equivalent to a "ICP low" code on a HEUI engine?

how would that 'code' definitively isolate the pump as the cause for low rail pressure, and not the VCV, PCV, or an injector issue?

any loss of efficiency/leak is going to cause low rail pressure...but wouldn't/couldn't identify the source of the inefficiency.

is this like saying that every HEUI engine that can't maintain ICP needs a pump asap, no?

It is exactly the same Dave, I just cant convince these people of that, So the people that have their tuner are now held hostage and required to change a pump that has life left in it. All the other tuners (ford including) has raised the limits to a level that will allow a longer lifespan of the pump.

p.s. i have 20k miles on that truck that yall said the pump had to be replaced now with no failure!

Travis

Bair · Dec 1, 2013

I think it's a little bit (or should I say a whole lot) risky to keep running your truck with a pump that is getting a little weak. I think Spartans philosophy on the matter is smart. My truck had a weak pump but it ran beautiful. Just had rail pressure dropping off. I decided just to keep running it and just not beat on it. Well one day the pump died. And so did all 8 injectors along with it. Others have had it happen as well. Nothing new. Ticking time bomb is right. These pumps will throw trash into the fuel system, UNLIKE the hpop of the heui system, when they fail. Tomorrow when your hpfp fails and costs you a new fuel system, you may view this scenario a little differently.

drunk on diesel · Dec 2, 2013

did you have the latest update from Ford?

My buddy just lost the HPFP on his 2010. It was bone stock up until 6 months ago. Truck has 95k on it or so now. He's been running H&S HD300 since the day he got it.

The truck didn't kick a single code. It was down on power intermittently and he kept beating the crap out of it trying to get something to actually FAIL if it was going to (he works in the field and wanted it to fail near home vs. out in the field)

The truck just up and died. New HPFP and it's been running great ever since.

YMMV

Dzchey21 · Dec 2, 2013

6.4 Stroker said:
I think I'd check the low pressure side of fuel before throwing a new HPFP at it.
Who knows you might get lucky.

couldnt agree more with this

all big tunes are going to ask allot of the stock pump, each tuner has a set perameter for the below threshold of the rail pressure

also pw differences between tunes can change this as well

let us know what pw and pressure is at WOT

B585Ford · Dec 2, 2013

dieseljosh07 said:
Good post, thanks Jeff.

I am asking you this question because you are defending Spartan on their parameter settings yet you don't work for them so I assume your opinion will not be biased. Assuming that you are correct in that the Spartan is throwing codes because of their tighter tolerances for RP than H&S has and the variations of RP are not bad enough (yet) for the H&S to throw a code, why is the truck running so much worse with the Spartan? Is it your opinion that the truck is going into limp mode with the Spartan? If so, is there any way to confirm that?

dieseljosh07 · Dec 3, 2013

B585Ford said:
I am asking you this question because you are defending Spartan on their parameter settings yet you don't work for them so I assume your opinion will not be biased. Assuming that you are correct in that the Spartan is throwing codes because of their tighter tolerances for RP than H&S has and the variations of RP are not bad enough (yet) for the H&S to throw a code, why is the truck running so much worse with the Spartan? Is it your opinion that the truck is going into limp mode with the Spartan? If so, is there any way to confirm that?

The presents of code P0088 with the Spartan tune and lack of the same code confirms that Spartan has a smaller tolerates for excessive rail pressure. Like Jeff confirmed for us, Spartan is aware of the wider parameter adopted by both Ford and H&S and choose not to include it in there tunes. How much longer will a HPFP last with H&S tunes? That's impossible to predict, to many variables that can affect the pumps lifespan. Your correct, I don't work for Spartan or H&S, but I sell both tuners. All I do is answer a potential customers questions about each tuner honestly and let them make there own choice of which tuner to purchase.