Keep My 2012 Or Upgrade

[maxxedout]

I'm at a loss for which way to go here, so I thought I'd ask for opinions.

I have a 2012 CCSB Lariat with about 125K on the clock. I'm at the point where I either want to trade into something newer, or take mine to whatever the next step would be performance-wise. My truck was ordered with pretty much every option you could get in 2012, so it would cost almost 70K to replace it with a 2017. If I keep my truck, it's going to need some transmission work before I push it any further. The transmission doesn't seem to have an issue with the power I'm running now, but with 125K, it's probably due for an overhaul.

If I keep the truck, I'd probably want to go with either a larger VGT than what I'm running or a non VGT SXE kit. I'd prefer not to push anything to the point where I'd need rods, so low 600's would be my ideal goal for now. I'd also probably want to switch from the Mini Maxx to S*partan when they have all the latest and greatest features and SOTF available on 11-12 trucks.

Either way, this isn't going to be cheap, so the choice is either putting money down on a new truck, or using the same money to build mine, and keep it for another 4-5 years.

Any suggestions or opinions would be appreciated.

 

[bigrpowr]

do the performance upgrades. WAY cheaper that way .

 

[Six_Sloww]

Keep and upgrade x2

Why would you switch from a minimaxx to a s*artan?

Nothing against s*artan but you still have way more options with mcc

 

[maxxedout]

Keep and upgrade x2

Why would you switch from a minimaxx to a s*artan?

Nothing against s*artan but you still have way more options with mcc

My concern with the Mini Maxx is support of later Ford calibrations. If I have a transmission built for the truck, I don't have a way of changing the solenoid body strategy without updating the TCM, and thus losing all of my tunes. If H&S doesn't support the Mini Maxx anymore, I don't know how I'd re-tune the truck after a re-flash. I work for a Ford dealer, and our transmission tech told me that IDS will automatically update the TCM if we change the solenoid strategy. Our shop doesn't do a lot of 6R140 work though, so maybe there's a way around this that our guys aren't aware of?

 

[mfoltz]

If you have the money I would upgrade to the 17.

 

[Tom@BigTimeKustomz]

If your truck is paid off, then I would hang onto it. It is certainly cheaper to put a trans in yours then buy a brand new truck.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[bigrpowr]

My concern with the Mini Maxx is support of later Ford calibrations. If I have a transmission built for the truck, I don't have a way of changing the solenoid body strategy without updating the TCM, and thus losing all of my tunes. If H&S doesn't support the Mini Maxx anymore, I don't know how I'd re-tune the truck after a re-flash. I work for a Ford dealer, and our transmission tech told me that IDS will automatically update the TCM if we change the solenoid strategy. Our shop doesn't do a lot of 6R140 work though, so maybe there's a way around this that our guys aren't aware of?

you'll be just fine on the updates. just buy from a reputable vendor and not amazon or ebay . if you buy from me, rest assured , no issues with updating .

 

[maxxedout]

you'll be just fine on the updates. just buy from a reputable vendor and not amazon or ebay . if you buy from me, rest assured , no issues with updating .

I have the Mini Maxx already... I have a set of tunes from Midwest and some tunes from Matt @ GH. Honestly, I'm just kind of bored with things the way they are now, and I'm not sure what else is available for the Mini Maxx.

The Midwest engine tune runs well, and the transmission holds the power. However, the reports of how "refined" everyone says the S*partan tunes are is what caught my attention. The GH tunes for my truck were VERY smooth, but we never got them dialed in 100%. I had some surging issues with the turbo, and I don't think the transmission tuning was strong enough to match the power. I don't mean to discredit Matt @ GH at all... I dropped the ball because it just wasn't working out, and I got tired of the back & forth. To date, those tunes were the smoothest I had ever run, but they just weren't 100% there.

If I keep the truck, a No Limit intake is a must, but I cringe at the idea of having to go around and around with tuning again. I've been alright with things being "good enough", but it's either time for some more mods that will compliment the truck, or to start over with a clean slate.

 

[HOUTX01X]

I was in the same boat. I was planning on getting the '17 when they came out. I only recently cracked 100k miles. I started to do the numbers, ended up doing H/S turbo, no limit intercooler/intake, OUO traction bars/blocks. I like not having a note. It's not that I don't have the $$$ for a new truck but i'd rather allocate those funds for something with a better ROI. (ie: purchase more rental homes)

 

[maxxedout]

I was in the same boat. I was planning on getting the '17 when they came out. I only recently cracked 100k miles. I started to do the numbers, ended up doing H/S turbo, no limit intercooler/intake, OUO traction bars/blocks. I like not having a note. It's not that I don't have the $$$ for a new truck but i'd rather allocate those funds for something with a better ROI. (ie: purchase more rental homes)

Yeah, that's another variable in the equation... I'm hoping to buy my first house this year, and it would make life easier if I could get a solid 4-5 years or 250K total out of my truck. I'm just not sure where to go with it from where I'm at.

 

[drunk on diesel]

My concern with the Mini Maxx is support of later Ford calibrations. If I have a transmission built for the truck, I don't have a way of changing the solenoid body strategy without updating the TCM, and thus losing all of my tunes. If H&S doesn't support the Mini Maxx anymore, I don't know how I'd re-tune the truck after a re-flash. I work for a Ford dealer, and our transmission tech told me that IDS will automatically update the TCM if we change the solenoid strategy. Our shop doesn't do a lot of 6R140 work though, so maybe there's a way around this that our guys aren't aware of?

Factory updates don't mean a whole lot. When you load an aftermarket tune, it wipes out whatever update you put on the truck. So updating the solenoid strategy doesn't really do anything when you are going to wipe out whatever you updated the TCM with. Unless you opt not to tune the trans. But you're going to if you want 600.

There are H&S updates out there, just get with a trusted vendor.

H&S tunes every truck with one strategy. MCC gives access to solenoid functions.

if you're getting a 1-2 slam shift, it's easy to tune out in MCC. It surprises me how many custom MCC tunes still do this

Anyhow, if you're already staring down a trans rebuild, I'd consider getting a newer truck. With a 15-16, you have a better pump and turbo, and a radiused crank. Yes, you'll be putting a trans in it eventually, but you can make 550 pretty reliably with readily available tuning.

 

[drunk on diesel]

wait... I just read your sig!

I'd keep what you've got

 

[SpartanDieselTech]

I'm at a loss for which way to go here, so I thought I'd ask for opinions.

I have a 2012 CCSB Lariat with about 125K on the clock. I'm at the point where I either want to trade into something newer, or take mine to whatever the next step would be performance-wise. My truck was ordered with pretty much every option you could get in 2012, so it would cost almost 70K to replace it with a 2017. If I keep my truck, it's going to need some transmission work before I push it any further. The transmission doesn't seem to have an issue with the power I'm running now, but with 125K, it's probably due for an overhaul.

If I keep the truck, I'd probably want to go with either a larger VGT than what I'm running or a non VGT SXE kit. I'd prefer not to push anything to the point where I'd need rods, so low 600's would be my ideal goal for now. I'd also probably want to switch from the Mini Maxx to S*partan when they have all the latest and greatest features and SOTF available on 11-12 trucks.

Either way, this isn't going to be cheap, so the choice is either putting money down on a new truck, or using the same money to build mine, and keep it for another 4-5 years.

Any suggestions or opinions would be appreciated.

We have an announcement to make early next week concerning tuning that will certainly be relevant to what you are looking for :thumbsup:

 

[maxxedout]

Factory updates don't mean a whole lot. When you load an aftermarket tune, it wipes out whatever update you put on the truck. So updating the solenoid strategy doesn't really do anything when you are going to wipe out whatever you updated the TCM with. Unless you opt not to tune the trans. But you're going to if you want 600.

There are H&S updates out there, just get with a trusted vendor.

H&S tunes every truck with one strategy. MCC gives access to solenoid functions.

if you're getting a 1-2 slam shift, it's easy to tune out in MCC. It surprises me how many custom MCC tunes still do this

Anyhow, if you're already staring down a trans rebuild, I'd consider getting a newer truck. With a 15-16, you have a better pump and turbo, and a radiused crank. Yes, you'll be putting a trans in it eventually, but you can make 550 pretty reliably with readily available tuning.

The solenoid strategy and TCM programming are two different things. You can't just swap a transmission from one truck to another anymore. The TCM has to be programmed with the valve body's unique strategy code. To my knowledge, that's not an available function in MCC. If there's a way to program the solenoid strategy without updating the TCM calibration, that would make life a lot easier. I'm all ears if someone knows how to do that.

 

[drunk on diesel]

I think you might be a little wrapped up in factory speak.

The "strategy" is part& parcel with the tune.

When you reprogram the TCM, you change the strategy.

You can swap transmissions without changing the strategy.

 

[maxxedout]

I think you might be a little wrapped up in factory speak.

The "strategy" is part& parcel with the tune.

When you reprogram the TCM, you change the strategy.

You can swap transmissions without changing the strategy.

On a 6.7 Diesel/6R140 transmission, it's not that simple. Two identical transmissions out of two identical trucks are not necessarily swap-able from one truck to another. The main control (valve & solenoid body) has a thirteen-digit solenoid body strategy code and an eight-digit solenoid body identification code. It is my understanding that these codes must be programmed into the truck using IDS. For whatever reason, Ford uses a mix of normally high and normally low solenoids with different "band" numbers, so it's possible to have two main control units (valve bodies) with different codes. I personally haven't done much with the 6R140 transmission, and neither has our shop, but it's my understanding that failing to program the correct codes to the TCM can cause driveability issues and transmission damage. Again, I don't have hands-on experience with these... All I'm doing is reading the Ford workshop manual.

 

[Cheap6.7]

I have the Mini Maxx already... I have a set of tunes from Midwest and some tunes from Matt @ GH. Honestly, I'm just kind of bored with things the way they are now, and I'm not sure what else is available for the Mini Maxx.

The Midwest engine tune runs well, and the transmission holds the power. However, the reports of how "refined" everyone says the S*partan tunes are is what caught my attention. The GH tunes for my truck were VERY smooth, but we never got them dialed in 100%. I had some surging issues with the turbo, and I don't think the transmission tuning was strong enough to match the power. I don't mean to discredit Matt @ GH at all... I dropped the ball because it just wasn't working out, and I got tired of the back & forth. To date, those tunes were the smoothest I had ever run, but they just weren't 100% there.

If I keep the truck, a No Limit intake is a must, but I cringe at the idea of having to go around and around with tuning again. I've been alright with things being "good enough", but it's either time for some more mods that will compliment the truck, or to start over with a clean slate.

I'm with ya %100 on giving up on back and forth with tunes... Tiresome

 

[Sterling6.7]

On a 6.7 Diesel/6R140 transmission, it's not that simple. Two identical transmissions out of two identical trucks are not necessarily swap-able from one truck to another. The main control (valve & solenoid body) has a thirteen-digit solenoid body strategy code and an eight-digit solenoid body identification code. It is my understanding that these codes must be programmed into the truck using IDS. For whatever reason, Ford uses a mix of normally high and normally low solenoids with different "band" numbers, so it's possible to have two main control units (valve bodies) with different codes. I personally haven't done much with the 6R140 transmission, and neither has our shop, but it's my understanding that failing to program the correct codes to the TCM can cause driveability issues and transmission damage. Again, I don't have hands-on experience with these... All I'm doing is reading the Ford workshop manual.

I believe this to be true based on reading some other threads. Probably worth a call to Morgan at Midwest and discuss his transmissions, tunes and the process.

 

[drunk on diesel]

On a 6.7 Diesel/6R140 transmission, it's not that simple. Two identical transmissions out of two identical trucks are not necessarily swap-able from one truck to another. The main control (valve & solenoid body) has a thirteen-digit solenoid body strategy code and an eight-digit solenoid body identification code. It is my understanding that these codes must be programmed into the truck using IDS. For whatever reason, Ford uses a mix of normally high and normally low solenoids with different "band" numbers, so it's possible to have two main control units (valve bodies) with different codes. I personally haven't done much with the 6R140 transmission, and neither has our shop, but it's my understanding that failing to program the correct codes to the TCM can cause driveability issues and transmission damage. Again, I don't have hands-on experience with these... All I'm doing is reading the Ford workshop manual.

Interesting. Sort of like injector codes.

Chrysler says you have to enter the injector codes on the 6.7 Diesel when you replace them. But I've swapped injectors and ECM's without addressing them and had zero issues.

if the band/solenoid info is stored outside of the tune, I can certainly see how this is something that should be done. However... if it is the case, it should not prevent you from updating the truck. There is always a work-around with getting an H&S loaded up. Get with a good vendor and they'll get you updated.

 

[maxxedout]

The 6.7 in our trucks is the same in that regard. Each injector has its own "IQA" code that must be programmed into the PCM. Will the truck run without programming the IQA? Yes, it probably will, but it may not run 100% right, or it may take extra time for the PCM to figure out the exact fueling characteristics of the injector. The transmission is different though; I think Ford deliberately over complicated the solenoid valve body (main control) to make it difficult for independent shops to do work on the 6R140. That's just my theory though...

As far as my truck goes, I'm curious to see what S*partan comes up with. I'd even be open to trying another company's MCC tunes. I've just been so hesitant to change anything because I don't want to deal with the back and forth of getting tunes dialed in. i know it's inevitable, but hopefully there's been more R&D and testing since the last time I tried "custom" tunes for my truck.